Hidden pie menu options
#11 07-01-2016 
(07-01-2016 01:48 AM)BoilingOil Wrote:  Ah, I thought we were becoming fast friends, and then you find it necessary to insult me! :-(

I'm sorry you feel that way. I assure you that was not my intention. I added the parenthesis to make clear that it could just as well be me not explaining things. What I wanted to say is that there is a miscommunication going on.

I hear what you are saying, and I appreciate you taking the time to write it out. It cleared up a few question marks. We're still not understanding each other though, so I hope you are okay with me trying again.

(07-01-2016 01:48 AM)BoilingOil Wrote:  
(06-01-2016 07:37 PM)gummilutt Wrote:  You say it would possibly cause the option to appear on chairs a Sim is not sitting in. That is how it works vanilla. The option appears on all chairs (assuming you have allmenus on), but if you click it and the Sim is not sitting in the chair, the action falls out of queue and nothing happens.

Yes, and THAT is what would happen in your game if you remove that check as well. The system would still prevent the sim from snoozing in a chair that it is not sitting in, but why would one want to have an option that is going to fall out of the queue anyway? THAT is why the test is in the Guardian as well. It may not be as elaborate and effective, but it;s good enough to keep out an option that would not work if you selected it.

This part is confusing me. With the check intact, choosing the interaction causes it to fall out of queue and do nothing. Are you saying that removing it would mean it still happens? I've tested, and it doesn't. It allows the action check to take over and the Sim walks over to the chair and sits down. You're saying it would not work, but when I test it in game it does not work when the check is intact, and it does work when the check is removed. What am I missing in what you are saying?

From what you wrote, it sounds to me like guardian bhav should only check if the option should appear or not. Therefore, if using allmenus on to show it, it should no longer affect the outcome. But it does. If the check is in the guardian bhav, the interaction fails and falls out of queue, unless the Sim is already sitting down.

As to leaving the check or not. It does not make sense to me to require the Sim to be sitting down, when the menu option is a free option. Compare it to a Sim using the computer. If you direct a Sim to use the computer when it's elsewhere, the Sim proceeds to sit down in the chair and then use the computer. The interaction doesn't fall out of queue, forcing you to first direct your Sim to sit and then the computer-interaction. This is how I think it should work here too, since snooze is not nested under sit (nested as in appearing only when the Sim sits down, with a dot in front of the name to indicate it's a sub-action to sitting down).

However, I accept that you are seeing some kind of problem with this that I am not seeing, and that your protests are valid protests. I want to remove the check, because I think not doing so makes the mod player-unfriendly. People are going to think it does not work because the interaction will fall away, and writing in mod description that Sim must sit first won't work because most people don't read. Technically their problem, but my sense of pride in my own creations require me to figure out something better than "just deal with it". It sounds to me like the problems you see are based on possible autonomic use of this interaction. Would the things you see cease being a problem, if I add a line in the guardian that stops autonomic behavior? I'd rather have it enabled and not autonomous, than the other way around.

#12 08-01-2016 
Ok, one last attempt: with your version of the mod, have you tried putting TWO chairs in the room, then let the sim sit in chair one, and select the "Snooze" option on chair two? That should be an interesting thing. With the test in the Guardian intact, the snooze option should not even APPEAR on the second chair (because it isn't the same chair as which the sim is sitting in), but I think it will now you have removed the test. THAT is the kind of trouble I'm talking about.

#13 08-01-2016 
I have, yes. With armchairs, the Sim will always get up, walk over, sit down and then snooze. However, with sectional sofas (which apparently have the snooze interaction), the Sim will teleport over (that weird quick-float teleport) to the other one you selected, and then proceed to snooze. I imagine it has something to do with the coding that makes them sectional and it counting as the same object even if they aren't connected, where as two armchairs of the same type are still two separate objects.

I can work around it by adding a "walk here"-line in front of sit in the action bhav, but that occasionally makes the Sim teleport-jump when sitting down, and that's not a solution in my mind. After all, how often will you come across a Sim sitting in a sectional sofa while you direct it to snooze in a second sectional sofa-piece? I will of course mention the jump-bug as a known problem.

I realize though that I had only tested it with the test still there when using allmenus rather than having removed hide menu line, so I went ahead and tested it properly. You were right, leaving the check but removing hide menu means the option no longer shows up unless the Sim is sitting down and only on the chair it's sitting in. So I think what I should do is offer both versions. I prefer the option to only appear when a Sim is sitting, but if one wants to line up a queue of things that would mean you can't until you had your Sim sit down and then selected snooze, so I think some people might prefer the option to be available always. I also imagine people might forget it exists if it only comes up when a Sim is sitting, since there are no other interactions that do that and you don't normally go around clicking seats your Sim is sitting in. Having both should cover all people Smile Thanks for pointing that out, and insisting I did not get what you were saying.

#14 08-01-2016 
Ok, I'm glad we sorted that out, finally. And yes, the sectionals are a bit odd. They are considered all a single object even when they are really not. But on sofas, I would prefer the sim to lounge or take a nap rather than to snooze, anyway.

#15 08-01-2016 
Very strange, but I'm glad there's an explanation to the jump bug. At first I didn't see the connection and thought it was happening randomly, which made it hard to test. But then it clicked and I realized it was only the sectional sofas.

I'm not sure when I'll upload it. I'm un-hiding a bunch of other ones (which are less complicated as I'm not making any other edits to them aside from removing hide menu, so far) and I'd like to release them all at once. But expect a nice big credit for all the help with this one <3

#16 08-01-2016 
I enjoy your appreciation @gummilutt, and I'll like the credit too. But it is *not* a requirement, ok? I've learned from many others as well, when I was new at this, but I seldom credit anyone for those lessons. In stead, I choose to return the favor to the community by helping the less experienced in the same manner that I was once helped. It goes without say that the experienced help the inexperienced. Because without that there would be no continuation. Tongue

#17 08-01-2016 
Yes, I know that. But just as you think it goes without saying that experienced help inexperienced, I think it goes without saying that you give credit where credit is due. Just because it makes sense to help out newer creators, it doesn't mean you have to, and you deserve recognition for being a nice person Smile


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