Bounding box problems
#31 22-01-2016 
I know you don't want to hear it, because you shot this idea down once before, @gummilutt. But if I see how much trouble this is giving you, I still feel that a simple model car in inventory - with an appropriate carpool BHAV that recognizes this as owning a car - would solve things much quicker and easier.

Ok, so it won't count as "Buy a car". So what? Your sim *didn't* buy a car, either with your method or with mine. Far be it from me to tell you how to play your game. But the way I see it, if you're not actually buying them a real car, you could always use the testingcheats method to fulfill the want. Because once the buy-a-car want is fulfilled with an actual purchase, I wouldn't be surprised if other car-related wants got triggered. Wants such as "Drive to work" that you cannot fulfill because they don't really own a car that can be driven!

#32 22-01-2016 
I see your point BO, but how would owning a car by having it inventory and assigning it be any different? I'd still have to fix the code that tries to make the Sim drive to work when they own a car. Unless I write my own version of not getting a car pool, but I wouldn't even know where to start with that. Besides, I can't find any proof that deleting joints were a problem, so unless a problem surfaces the object is already done.

I know it's a technicality, but the way I see it my Sims are getting a car. Not a car they can drive, but it's still a car. The original version of this came from a request for a tiny car that fulfills car wants. People pointed out that there is a painting that counts as a car and fills that want, but the user wanted it to look like a car. I then came up with the idea to make it be an actual car you can own when I played the household I mentioned in the first post.

Most importantly, I've always been prone to give up. I want to make one thing but run into trouble along the way, and I settle for something isn't quite what I wanted but easier to do. I'm never going to grow as a creator if I just give up when I encounter problems, or take the easier route. This one time I'd like to make the thing I wanted to make, and not settle for something almost that.

I've found a bunch of BHAVs that I believe hold the code that pushes drive to work. They are all intertwined, calling each other, so I'm going to try and figure out which one is the original and see if I can edit it to disable automatic drive to work with regular cars. Then once I know I have the right code, I'll try to condition it to my tiny cars.

#33 22-01-2016 
It's not even for yourself? I fear you've taken on too big a request there.

#34 22-01-2016 
No no, this is for me. I modified the decorative tiny car to fill want, and sent that Smile I just got the idea for this project from that request. And I actually kind of don't want my Sims to automatically go to work, so figuring out the bhavs is not a bad thing either Smile

#35 22-01-2016 
Just checking in to say that I've been travelling today, but now I'm back home and on my simming computer, yay! Big Grin Unfortunately I'm way too knackered for coherent thought, but once I get a good night's sleep I'll be happy to talk some about joints and skeletons and how they work. (Might be able to lend a hand in the BHAV-digging, too, if you want.) Right now though, if your tiny car doesn't crash or throw errors when you place it/try to move it around/hover over it/have a Sim interact with it, then you should be good. If there was a problem, you'd get error messages and/or crashes, or it would simply refuse to be placed. Since it isn't doing any of those things, you haven't deleted anything that's crucial for your car to work. Smile

#36 22-01-2016 
If I don't find it tonight, I'd be very grateful for digging-help. I was hoping it'd be obvious by having a push interaction line in it, but I've only found one with that line so far, and that one was not the right one. BO has been wonderfully helpful in teaching me what different expressions mean, but I still don't understand half of what I see so sometimes it's difficult to dig since I might not get it even if I find it Tongue

Are there any other lines that push interactions than the one that has push interaction written in it? As long as I know what line should be in the bhav, finding it should just be a matter of time.

#37 23-01-2016 

Well, if it *is* for yourself, then let me say this: if it were *me*, I'd prefer a solution that works - even if it doesn't have *all* the features that I'd like - over weeks of toiling and in the end having nothing working at all. The point is, if you have a toy that goes in the sim's inventory, it does not need to be assigned to anyone. It belongs only to the sim carrying it. Period. And if we edit ONLY the Carpool BHAV to check for an object of a specific GUID in the sim's inventory, no other system is ever going to notice the difference. No other system will consider this sim as 'owning a car', because we don't tell them what to look for. Your sim will no longer automatically go to work. Only if you ORDER them to "Walk to work" they will go and do their job. But otherwise, they will get in trouble for not showing up. But at least everything else will continue to work as it was supposed to.

On the other hand, if you *do* get this running the way you want - with your sims' buy-a-car wants fulfilled, and them actually 'owning a car, even if they can't sit in it' - who guarantees that your sims - which are now proper car owners - will not roll all those wants to "sit in a car", "make out in car", "woohoo in car", "drive somewhere", "drive to work" etc. etc. and so on, and so forth? These are but a few examples of wants that might come up, but which can not be fulfilled at all, because your sims will not HAVE a car that they can actually sit and drive in. If that happens, many more BHAVs will need to be modified. And probably wants files as well. And I know *naught* about editing wants files. The method that I propose, requires changes in only one BHAV, two tops.

And you may not know where to start with editing that BHAV just yet, but some people here - including yours truly - may be able to help. And how much do you know about what you are trying to do now???

Ok, I'll grant you this: we do not yet have proof that the joints are the problem. You're absolutely right about that. But what else do we know? Are we any closer? Even with help from all the assembled object modding wizards here - and they are wizards with great talent and skill indeed -, it's not yet looking very good. You're getting crashes and hanging games and what-not.

And I? I have no clue of what's going on. I can not be of any assistance at all. Except for maybe proposing alternative solutions, which I am trying to do. And I have successfully made several BHAVs look for objects in inventories. So I *know* that I can do that. And I might be able to teach you the same! Smile

#38 23-01-2016 
I think you might have gotten confused somewhere along the reading of what I've written, BO. The crashes and errors have all been with versions of the car where I tried to add a bounding box without removing joints, or tried to use a decorative object as base. If I don't try to add a bounding box, there are no crashes or errors, the only problem is that the car is hard to pick up once placed. If I delete the joints and then add a bounding box, it does not error, crash, or do anything problematic at all, and the bounding box is correctly updated. I've been playing with them in my main game for two Sim days now, and the only problem I've uncovered is that Sims owning one will try to use it to drive to work.

You are right though, Sims may roll wants related to using the car. In my game, I intend to use this object for people that have a real car and either have the same work hours, or one works night and the other day, and therefore can share the one car they have. In other words, I don't want to use it in a situation where a Sim is unable to fill those wants due to only having a tiny car, because they'll always have a full version of the car.

However, just because I intend to use it that way does not mean everyone will. Some might use it in a situation where they don't have a full size car, and for those the wants would be troublesome. So if it's all right with you, I'll make both systems and people can choose which they prefer. Either a decorative car in inventory that stops the carpool, or a real tiny car you can own. It ought to be easy to do your version, the correct BHAVs should be in simlogicals institution sign which saves me time having to figure out which ones are the right ones. Perhaps it'll even have the code I need for my tiny car.

EDIT: Nope, institution sign was not helpful at all. Back to digging the old fashion way Smile
(This post was last modified: 23-01-2016 02:06 PM by gummilutt.)

#39 23-01-2016 
@gummilutt do you still wish to talk about joints, or do you want to focus on BHAVs for the time being? (We can do both, of course; I can multi-task like that. Wink)

What exactly have you done with the BHAVs so far? Did you just delete them along with the pie menu functions and strings, or do you still have some (or all) in your package, or...? 'Cause I've been picking a car apart, and I have a theory this semi global called "Sub - Send to Work" (you have to dig some to find it, it's called by "Interaction - Go to Work", that in turn is called by "Interaction - Ownable - Work", which is linked to the "Drive to Work" pie menu function) might be a key player, but I need to know what you've done BHAV-wise first. (That, or look at your car so I can see for myself - but I understand completely if you don't want to share it with anybody yet!)

#40 23-01-2016 
With my tiny car I deleted all BHAVs except Function - Init, since they weren't doing anything any more with the options removed. I tested afterwords to see it did not cause any problems, and from what I can tell, it was fine.

When it comes to digging, I looked up the group for car semi globals, and I filtered M&G objects package by that. I then went over the list of BHAVs in that group, and extracted anything that seemed plausible to be related, and imported them into a new package so I could go through them and try to track down the relevant one. Sub - Send to Work is actually the first one I tried editing to see if it was the right one. I tried changing it's true's to false one by one, and the Sim still goes to work with her regular size car that she owns.

I didn't get a whole lot done last night, BHAV-wise. I was tired and found it hard to focus in a productive way. Tonight I promised friends I'd hang out, and I have to study now, so I won't get much done today either. It feels rather wrong to ask you to look at it when I'm going to do other things myself, but if you do want to look and you find something relevant I'll be back later tonight.

Joint talk is welcome, if you have time/energy. It does seem to be working, but I'd still like to understand it better Smile


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